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Forum: VirtualDJ Technical Support

Topic: Proper Echo out - Page: 2

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Hi DJ Pari & Locodog

Thank you for sharing this script !
Very handy because I also use this 'Freeze Echo' effect during my sets.
I'm new to VDJ and am still testing and experimenting with the program (I am current Traktor user but will probably do the switch to VDJ, if I can configure the software to my personal preferences).
For testing purposes I mapped the script to a 'custom button'.
The only thing about this script is that when I deactivate the button, the filter knob keeps on decreasing (even though the 'loop effect' is stopped, the filter knob keeps on turning until it reaches 0 (<20Hz)).
What must I add to the script so the filter stops decreasing the moment I deactivate the effect ? (so when deactivate: stop loop, stop decreasing filter and set filter back to it's begin value (OFF)). I'm completely new (inexperienced) to script-programming.

(Now my adjusted script is: Deck 1 loop 1 & repeat_start 'rsiVolumeDrop' 110ms 33 & filter -1%)

Thanks !
Kristof
 
Posted Sat 20 May 17 @ 4:25 pm
locoDogPRO InfinityModeratorMember since 2013
Deck 1 toggle 'press' & Deck 1 loop 1 & var 'press' ? repeat_start 'rsiVolumeDrop' 110ms 33 & filter -1% : repeat_stop 'rsiVolumeDrop'

Your previous script had no stop point either by count nor condition,
I changed it so a variable is toggled to either 1 or 0 when a button is pressed, then queried the variable, is it a start press or a stop press? Then it carries out adjust the filter, or stop adjusting the filter.
see my blog
https://www.virtualdj.com/user/locodog/blogs/5458/How_to__Perform_A_Action_Automatically_When_A_Track_Is_Loaded.html

It covers repeat_start scripts and more
 
Posted Sat 20 May 17 @ 6:58 pm
If Atomix would model its echo plug-in after a true echo effect none of this would be needed. There would be no need for the echoout or loopout. I know this is a DJ program but effects are to be thought as a d.a.w. pre and post fader capabilities.
 
Posted Sat 20 May 17 @ 9:41 pm
Djratedxxx919 wrote :
If Atomix would model its echo plug-in after a true echo effect none of this would be needed. There would be no need for the echoout or loopout. I know this is a DJ program but effects are to be thought as a d.a.w. pre and post fader capabilities.


VDJ have pre and post fader effects these days
As shown in this echo example:

Is somehing still missing?
 
Posted Sun 21 May 17 @ 1:12 pm
locoDogPRO InfinityModeratorMember since 2013
Djratedxxx919 wrote :
If Atomix would model its echo plug-in after a true echo effect none of this would be needed. There would be no need for the echoout or loopout. I know this is a DJ program but effects are to be thought as a d.a.w. pre and post fader capabilities.


You keep saying this but never actually clarify what you mean, surely if there's what you call a true echo out fx there'll be an example you can show of either a competitor's software or a vst
 
Posted Sun 21 May 17 @ 10:44 pm
I always explain it...but no one understands. Like they never used an echo effect. The parameter Strenght seem to control Vol and Feedback, so to have a loud echo you also have to have a long number of echoes. If the effect was designed as a d.a.w. type echo with volume and separate feedback parameter you get tighter control of the echo. Loud echo fewer repeat times. So the echo doesnt last 2minutes. I have video if no one understands. Or just look at pro tools, cubase or any vst and look it has vol, repeat/feedback, length, filter. If you gonna do it do it right. Look at the rane 62, pio s9....all the same basic parameters. Im glad to have post fader, but i shouldnt have to use echo out or loopout, the are just workarounds to a post fader echo punch.
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 2:30 am
AdionPRO InfinityCTOMember since 2006
The pioneer s9 just has feedback to control from what i can see.
If you can select number of repeats it's a delay, not an echo.
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 6:02 am
locoDogPRO InfinityModeratorMember since 2013
Djratedxxx919 wrote :
I always explain it...but no one understands. Like they never used an echo effect. The parameter Strenght seem to control Vol and Feedback, so to have a loud echo you also have to have a long number of echoes. If the effect was designed as a d.a.w. type echo with volume and separate feedback parameter you get tighter control of the echo. Loud echo fewer repeat times. So the echo doesnt last 2minutes. I have video if no one understands. Or just look at pro tools, cubase or any vst and look it has vol, repeat/feedback, length, filter. If you gonna do it do it right. Look at the rane 62, pio s9....all the same basic parameters. Im glad to have post fader, but i shouldnt have to use echo out or loopout, the are just workarounds to a post fader echo punch.


If you keep explaining it an j nobody understands I'd say there's a problem with the explanation.

Try have dial 1 high, trailing button on, turn the fx on, wait for 1 time constant (however many beats your length setting is) then turn the echo fx off.

If it still echoes for too long, drop dial1 after you turn the fx off.

Dubloop shift pad one also does similar to this while pressed.
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 6:31 am
locodog wrote :
Djratedxxx919 wrote :
I always explain it...but no one understands. Like they never used an echo effect. The parameter Strenght seem to control Vol and Feedback, so to have a loud echo you also have to have a long number of echoes. If the effect was designed as a d.a.w. type echo with volume and separate feedback parameter you get tighter control of the echo. Loud echo fewer repeat times. So the echo doesnt last 2minutes. I have video if no one understands. Or just look at pro tools, cubase or any vst and look it has vol, repeat/feedback, length, filter. If you gonna do it do it right. Look at the rane 62, pio s9....all the same basic parameters. Im glad to have post fader, but i shouldnt have to use echo out or loopout, the are just workarounds to a post fader echo punch.


If you keep explaining it an j nobody understands I'd say there's a problem with the explanation.

Try have dial 1 high, trailing button on, turn the fx on, wait for 1 time constant (however many beats your length setting is) then turn the echo fx off.

If it still echoes for too long, drop dial1 after you turn the fx off.

Dubloop shift pad one also does similar to this while pressed.


Why do i have to drop the dial, why cant i just set the feedback let the effect do the job and i can continue on with mixing, Im tired of work arounds when its in the design. Also you mention my explaination, bare in mind, i have had disagreements about music starting on the one and not 0, I have had to prove why the beat grid and loop should start at the beginning of a beat and not in the middle. It felt like teaching music theory 101. things a DJ should know, but seem to not be able to grasp. Like echo effect need vol, feedback, length and filter as the basic parameters. Then you wont need echo out or loopout....
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 8:07 am
AdionPRO InfinityCTOMember since 2006
But with volume and feedback you would only be able to get the opposite of what you want, a longer echo that is more silent, instead of a shorter echo that is louder.
(I tried in FL Studio with the Fruity Delay 2 plugin, and that seems to work the same as vdj when volume is at 100%, and give reduced volume echos with volume below 100%)
If you know of a specific vst I should look at, or you have a clear video that shows it in some other software let me know.

A normal echo (like the one in vdj, and any other echo that I've come across) works by reducing the volume of each echo (similar to how an echo in the real world sounds), so you get something like: 100% 90% 81% 73% 65% etc... of the original sound. (With feedback at 90%, each echo is 10% more quiet than the previous one)
A volume control would only soften the echos, but with the same number of echo's before the sound is completely gone. At volume 50% you would get
100% 45% 40% 36% 32% etc...

From what I understand, you want something like:
100% 90% 80% 70% 0%

This cannot be achieved with an echo though, you need a delay bank of 3 delays without feedback for this, which is a different effect.
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 8:40 am
thx for the feedback on the command line locodog, I will give it a try !
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 4:38 pm
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 9:14 pm
@locodog: I adapted the script like you suggested and added an extra command to the script to reset the filter when effect is stopped.
Now script is:
Deck 1 toggle 'press' & Deck 1 loop 1 & var 'press' ? repeat_start 'rsiVolumeDrop' 200ms 40 & filter -1% : repeat_stop 'rsiVolumeDrop' & Filter 50%

Works very good !
Thanks !
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 9:25 pm
Adion wrote :
But with volume and feedback you would only be able to get the opposite of what you want, a longer echo that is more silent, instead of a shorter echo that is louder.
(I tried in FL Studio with the Fruity Delay 2 plugin, and that seems to work the same as vdj when volume is at 100%, and give reduced volume echos with volume below 100%)
If you know of a specific vst I should look at, or you have a clear video that shows it in some other software let me know.

A normal echo (like the one in vdj, and any other echo that I've come across) works by reducing the volume of each echo (similar to how an echo in the real world sounds), so you get something like: 100% 90% 81% 73% 65% etc... of the original sound. (With feedback at 90%, each echo is 10% more quiet than the previous one)
A volume control would only soften the echos, but with the same number of echo's before the sound is completely gone. At volume 50% you would get
100% 45% 40% 36% 32% etc...

From what I understand, you want something like:
100% 90% 80% 70% 0%

This cannot be achieved with an echo though, you need a delay bank of 3 delays without feedback for this, which is a different effect.


Your misunderstanding that fl effect, being companys will do things different you have to look at what they chose to label their way. SO with FL delay 2....
The input section controls echo level which is the equivilient to echo vol. The feed section controls the amount of times the echo is fed back, the vol knob in that section basic the equivilient to feedback amount. The cut parameter controls frequency time sets the space between echoes. So basically you were using it wrong. FL delay 2 works as a basic echo.
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 9:34 pm
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 11:26 pm
@locodog or another script specialist :-) : what do I have to add to the script (on custom button) to turn the effect (custom button) off when a new track is loaded in that deck ?
(script now: Deck 1 toggle 'press' & Deck 1 loop 1 & var 'press' ? repeat_start 'rsiVolumeDrop' 200ms 40 & filter -1% : repeat_stop 'rsiVolumeDrop' & Filter 50%)
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 11:27 pm
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 11:49 pm
wickedmix wrote :
looks like he is using a Delay plugin to me not echo :-)

Im using what he tested, The same thing can be achieved with an echo effect vst because feedback is feedback, vol is vol...ect.
pick any echo effect with volume and feedback separate you can get the same effect.

I mean this is basic audio mixing knowledge. Im not trying to be an arse or anything, but it be the basic music knowledge but no one seems to have it.
 
Posted Mon 22 May 17 @ 11:58 pm
lincol2PRO InfinityMember since 2011
@Djratedxxx919

"Echoex" looks very interesting to have.
 
Posted Tue 23 May 17 @ 12:31 am
locoDogPRO InfinityModeratorMember since 2013
@Kristof St

That would need a seperate repeat start script monitoring load pulse, I'll look at writing something up this evening.
 
Posted Tue 23 May 17 @ 7:20 am
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