Don Moir
i7 laptop with NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M and Intel HD Graphics 4000
Testing on 2nd monitor with a variety of test cases both in VDJ and outside VDJ. Using scroll test to watch for smoothness. I need to give some background to put this in perspective.
With NVIDIA set as the GPU:
o - with videoForceFullscreen set to 0, the scroll test stutters and not smooth. VDJ video played more like a slide projector than a video. My test outside of VDJ did not have these problems. The test outside of VDJ uses my own code and so I can compare VDJ and that with various parameters and test cases. In my own test case outside of VDJ, I still got a steady pulse about 1 per second in the scrolling test and that seems to be because vertical sync is not an absolute when running windowed on my setup here on 2nd monitor and probably holds true for many other setups.
When running on the laptop monitor, VDJ was still just as bad with NVIDIA as it was on 2nd monitor. My own test app was perfect smooth. Looks like vertical sync just works better on my laptop screen then it does on the 2nd monitor but it did not help VDJ any. VDJ was bad on 2nd monitor and laptop screen.
o - with videoForceFullscreen set to 1, this is where all hell breaks loose with VDJ. All this on 2nd monitor. Much ghosting and flashing when anything is on being displayed on the screen. This is with Video FPS set to 30. When Video FPS is set to 60, it settles down a lot but the ghosting comes back every now and then. Still not even close to good.
WIth my own test app it was perfect. No ghosting, no flashing, and absolutely smooth.
WIth the Intel GPU selected, everything was much better for VDJ. The same vertical sync pulse on 2nd monitor when in windowed mode. When videoForceFullScreen is set to 1, this vertical sync pulse goes away and everything was smooth for the Intel GPU only.
You recommend that videoForceFullScreen should be set to 0. Why? Is it because you know VDJ has problems with it? In the case of the NVIDIA above VDJ had all kinds of problems with it, but my own test app did not.
In all my test (3 different machines and setups), hardware full screen gave better results, except with VDJ and NVIDIA.
Testing on 2nd monitor with a variety of test cases both in VDJ and outside VDJ. Using scroll test to watch for smoothness. I need to give some background to put this in perspective.
With NVIDIA set as the GPU:
o - with videoForceFullscreen set to 0, the scroll test stutters and not smooth. VDJ video played more like a slide projector than a video. My test outside of VDJ did not have these problems. The test outside of VDJ uses my own code and so I can compare VDJ and that with various parameters and test cases. In my own test case outside of VDJ, I still got a steady pulse about 1 per second in the scrolling test and that seems to be because vertical sync is not an absolute when running windowed on my setup here on 2nd monitor and probably holds true for many other setups.
When running on the laptop monitor, VDJ was still just as bad with NVIDIA as it was on 2nd monitor. My own test app was perfect smooth. Looks like vertical sync just works better on my laptop screen then it does on the 2nd monitor but it did not help VDJ any. VDJ was bad on 2nd monitor and laptop screen.
o - with videoForceFullscreen set to 1, this is where all hell breaks loose with VDJ. All this on 2nd monitor. Much ghosting and flashing when anything is on being displayed on the screen. This is with Video FPS set to 30. When Video FPS is set to 60, it settles down a lot but the ghosting comes back every now and then. Still not even close to good.
WIth my own test app it was perfect. No ghosting, no flashing, and absolutely smooth.
WIth the Intel GPU selected, everything was much better for VDJ. The same vertical sync pulse on 2nd monitor when in windowed mode. When videoForceFullScreen is set to 1, this vertical sync pulse goes away and everything was smooth for the Intel GPU only.
You recommend that videoForceFullScreen should be set to 0. Why? Is it because you know VDJ has problems with it? In the case of the NVIDIA above VDJ had all kinds of problems with it, but my own test app did not.
In all my test (3 different machines and setups), hardware full screen gave better results, except with VDJ and NVIDIA.
Posted Thu 13 Nov 14 @ 10:51 am
Adion
Could you post a picture of this ghosting? Not sure what you mean by that.
Posted Fri 14 Nov 14 @ 8:13 am
Don Moir
Used TV and a couple other things to test this. The ghosting does not always happen but I captured it in the following images with a camera since it was on full screen. Ghosting happens often enough and flashing every time for everything.
In this image, there is only one image. The one on the left is not there :) The image is moving from right to left as it is supposed to but it is flashing all the time. Anything displayed on the screen like video etc... played on deck or anywhere is flashing badly. While the left image is not there, it is still flashing just like the right image. You can see the one on left is dim compared to one on the right. Here might be a clue for you though, the VDJ logo image is rock solid while all this is going on. I tried static non moving images and they flash just as bad so just the logo image is displaying like it is supposed to.
This next image shows a video playing on deck one after TV has been deactivated. The image that is not there is still visible :) The flashing never stops and it is occurring on the image and the video. Whole screen is flashing but not on and off, it is between bright and dim. Not a little flashing, a lot of flashing and enough to give you a headache.
This special weirdness only happens on this one machine with the NVIDIA GPU and with videoForceFullscreen set to 1. The flashing goes away when Video FPS is set to 60 with some ghosting but not nearly as much. With videoForceFullscreen set to 0, the flashing etc goes away, but everything plays like slideshow. No smoothness. I have not tried much to reproduce this outside of VDJ but I can try changing some parameters around and run some test for you if you like. I did run TV outside of VDJ with the same scroll test and video etc., and it was all fine in all respects with hardware full screen or windowed.
Like I said it does not matter what you run, flashing is always a problem. TV was just good for testing with the ghost images.
In this image, there is only one image. The one on the left is not there :) The image is moving from right to left as it is supposed to but it is flashing all the time. Anything displayed on the screen like video etc... played on deck or anywhere is flashing badly. While the left image is not there, it is still flashing just like the right image. You can see the one on left is dim compared to one on the right. Here might be a clue for you though, the VDJ logo image is rock solid while all this is going on. I tried static non moving images and they flash just as bad so just the logo image is displaying like it is supposed to.
This next image shows a video playing on deck one after TV has been deactivated. The image that is not there is still visible :) The flashing never stops and it is occurring on the image and the video. Whole screen is flashing but not on and off, it is between bright and dim. Not a little flashing, a lot of flashing and enough to give you a headache.
This special weirdness only happens on this one machine with the NVIDIA GPU and with videoForceFullscreen set to 1. The flashing goes away when Video FPS is set to 60 with some ghosting but not nearly as much. With videoForceFullscreen set to 0, the flashing etc goes away, but everything plays like slideshow. No smoothness. I have not tried much to reproduce this outside of VDJ but I can try changing some parameters around and run some test for you if you like. I did run TV outside of VDJ with the same scroll test and video etc., and it was all fine in all respects with hardware full screen or windowed.
Like I said it does not matter what you run, flashing is always a problem. TV was just good for testing with the ghost images.
Posted Fri 14 Nov 14 @ 5:58 pm
djcel
try VideoMicroFrames = None in the options
Posted Fri 14 Nov 14 @ 6:25 pm
Don Moir
videoMicroFrames was on never, but also tried smart and always. Had no effect. By the way I had no other effects, visualizations, or transitions running.
Posted Fri 14 Nov 14 @ 6:35 pm
archi333
I unknown the problem, but you can try this:
Go to nvidia driver control panel and find the PERSONALISED PROGRAMS.
Probably, virtual dj is using INTEGRATAD VIDEO CARD. change to NVIDIA GRAPHICS CARD.
Sorry for my bad english.
Go to nvidia driver control panel and find the PERSONALISED PROGRAMS.
Probably, virtual dj is using INTEGRATAD VIDEO CARD. change to NVIDIA GRAPHICS CARD.
Sorry for my bad english.
Posted Fri 23 Jan 15 @ 8:34 pm
archi333
Be carefully with video settings.
Sometimes video does not play perfect due various factors: transitions and settings on video tab. TRY NONE ON TRANSITIONS TAB.
My systems works fine under win7 on my laptop with virtual dj 7.4 (with nvidia 630m) and desktop computer (gtx 460) with xp sp3 (virtual dj8 one screen mix -mix and videos-). Coming soon i test vdj 8 on my laptop.
Sometimes video does not play perfect due various factors: transitions and settings on video tab. TRY NONE ON TRANSITIONS TAB.
My systems works fine under win7 on my laptop with virtual dj 7.4 (with nvidia 630m) and desktop computer (gtx 460) with xp sp3 (virtual dj8 one screen mix -mix and videos-). Coming soon i test vdj 8 on my laptop.
Posted Fri 23 Jan 15 @ 8:41 pm
Don Moir
arch, you should reread the first post or re-translate it. You will find it happened with NVIDIA and not Intel on this computer. I put this up as a public service announcement since I do not use VDJ as a DJ and it does not matter to me so just a note to others.
As another public service note :), don't assume NVIDIA will be better if you also have Intel. In the case of this computer Intel was much better for VDJ. Also note I have 2 other machines with NVIDIA and run perfectly fine.
The really bad problems only happened with VDJ8 and NVIDIA. I have not retested VDJ8 latest builds with NVIDIA to see if it has changed. Independent test outside of VDJ8 ran fine with NVIDIA on the problem machine.
As another public service note :), don't assume NVIDIA will be better if you also have Intel. In the case of this computer Intel was much better for VDJ. Also note I have 2 other machines with NVIDIA and run perfectly fine.
The really bad problems only happened with VDJ8 and NVIDIA. I have not retested VDJ8 latest builds with NVIDIA to see if it has changed. Independent test outside of VDJ8 ran fine with NVIDIA on the problem machine.
Posted Sat 24 Jan 15 @ 6:24 am
romeodan
just a question
i have the specs laptop with NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M ?? ( i think itis that ,its 2 gb) and Intel HD Graphics 4000
i only dj with audio -no video-,is it wise to use the NVIDIA graphics card for vdj instead of the Intel HD Graphics 4000 ?
will there be any gain from it ? or will i have more problems than i asked for.
will the cpu use go up ?
i ask because with the current setup ( with the Intel HD Graphics 4000 beeing the active card) when i am scrolling through folders or files on the vdj browser, i get like a slow motion fx on the waveforms ( i dont know how else to describe it,but in other words the waveforms are not running smoothly on the screen-choopy movement)
how would i enable the NVIDIA GEFORCE card in vdj just to try it out ?
i have the specs laptop with NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M ?? ( i think itis that ,its 2 gb) and Intel HD Graphics 4000
i only dj with audio -no video-,is it wise to use the NVIDIA graphics card for vdj instead of the Intel HD Graphics 4000 ?
will there be any gain from it ? or will i have more problems than i asked for.
will the cpu use go up ?
i ask because with the current setup ( with the Intel HD Graphics 4000 beeing the active card) when i am scrolling through folders or files on the vdj browser, i get like a slow motion fx on the waveforms ( i dont know how else to describe it,but in other words the waveforms are not running smoothly on the screen-choopy movement)
how would i enable the NVIDIA GEFORCE card in vdj just to try it out ?
Posted Sat 24 Jan 15 @ 9:07 am
RobRoy
1st question is... do you have issues right now ?
using the nvidia for the main screen should not be a problem. Just select vdj8.exe at the nvida control panel to use your 660....
using the nvidia for the main screen should not be a problem. Just select vdj8.exe at the nvida control panel to use your 660....
Posted Sat 24 Jan 15 @ 9:20 am
romeodan
no , i dont have any other problems besides the choopy movement of the waveforms when i scroll through my files.
it does not affect overall performance
i am just curious ..
it does not affect overall performance
i am just curious ..
Posted Sat 24 Jan 15 @ 9:23 am
RobRoy
just give it a try then... :-)
if you are not satisfied, you can simply switch back in the Nvidia Control Panel
and please check if your Display is working with it´s native resolution
if you are not satisfied, you can simply switch back in the Nvidia Control Panel
and please check if your Display is working with it´s native resolution
Posted Sat 24 Jan 15 @ 9:25 am
romeodan
i will do that !
thank you for the rapid responce !
thank you for the rapid responce !
Posted Sat 24 Jan 15 @ 9:26 am
Don Moir
You should try both the NVIDIA and Intel to see what gives you the best results.
With VDJ closed, to change between one and the other, right click on desktop somewhere, and you should see NVIDIA control panel or similiar in menu. Select that. From there you should have the choice to use the Integrated graphics or NVIDIA. The integrated graphics will be the Intel card. After you select one of these, hit apply in lower right of NVIDIA dialog box. Then run VDJ and see what you get. You can watch the visuals and CPU and gauge it for yourself. As noted you can also set VDJ to use one GPU or another as well specifically.
The slow movement of waveform could be the GPU card or it could be your skin FPS. The skin FPS tells VDJ how many times to draw the skin per second and default is 30. Also if running Vista or Windows 7 make sure aero is on. This can make a difference and seems to reduce context switching.
By the way, I saw very choppy movement on the problem machine when playing video and using NVIDIA in VDJ that went along with the assortment of testing mentioned above.
With VDJ closed, to change between one and the other, right click on desktop somewhere, and you should see NVIDIA control panel or similiar in menu. Select that. From there you should have the choice to use the Integrated graphics or NVIDIA. The integrated graphics will be the Intel card. After you select one of these, hit apply in lower right of NVIDIA dialog box. Then run VDJ and see what you get. You can watch the visuals and CPU and gauge it for yourself. As noted you can also set VDJ to use one GPU or another as well specifically.
The slow movement of waveform could be the GPU card or it could be your skin FPS. The skin FPS tells VDJ how many times to draw the skin per second and default is 30. Also if running Vista or Windows 7 make sure aero is on. This can make a difference and seems to reduce context switching.
By the way, I saw very choppy movement on the problem machine when playing video and using NVIDIA in VDJ that went along with the assortment of testing mentioned above.
Posted Sat 24 Jan 15 @ 9:29 am
romeodan
so, i changed the graphics card over to nvidia , and all the weird refresh and waveform freeze problems are gone !
cpu use is at normal (as always)
problem solved !
cpu use is at normal (as always)
problem solved !
Posted Sun 25 Jan 15 @ 2:57 am
Tomas Cerny (VeeJay Lizard)
Please how did you change it. I have same issue now.
Thank you Tomas.
Thank you Tomas.
Posted Fri 10 Apr 15 @ 8:03 am
Don Moir
Hi Tomas,
There are variations of this and not speaking to a waveform problem but video display problem. On my test machine for this case, it has an Intel and NVIDIA GPU. The Intel GPU has no problem. When I first tested this problem, the NVIDIA was bad any way you sliced it. Now it is still a problem, but setting the Video FPS to 60 seems to completely fix it. I spoke with another user who had the same problem and Video FPS @ 60 also fixed it for him.
Typically, a monitor will refresh the screen 60 times per second and matching the video FPS to this gives best results as I see it (even if you don't have a problem). Note: not all monitors refresh at 60 times per second but many do and you may need to play around with this depending on your monitor refresh rate.
There are a couple ways to change between GPU but following is a general case. You can also specify a GPU for a particular program such as VDJ.
With VDJ closed, to change between one and the other, right click on desktop somewhere, and you should see NVIDIA control panel or similiar in menu. Select that. From there you should have the choice to use the Integrated graphics or NVIDIA. The integrated graphics should be the Intel card. After you select one of these, hit apply in lower right of NVIDIA dialog box. Then run VDJ and see what you get. Don't forget to play with the Video FPS setting.
There are variations of this and not speaking to a waveform problem but video display problem. On my test machine for this case, it has an Intel and NVIDIA GPU. The Intel GPU has no problem. When I first tested this problem, the NVIDIA was bad any way you sliced it. Now it is still a problem, but setting the Video FPS to 60 seems to completely fix it. I spoke with another user who had the same problem and Video FPS @ 60 also fixed it for him.
Typically, a monitor will refresh the screen 60 times per second and matching the video FPS to this gives best results as I see it (even if you don't have a problem). Note: not all monitors refresh at 60 times per second but many do and you may need to play around with this depending on your monitor refresh rate.
There are a couple ways to change between GPU but following is a general case. You can also specify a GPU for a particular program such as VDJ.
With VDJ closed, to change between one and the other, right click on desktop somewhere, and you should see NVIDIA control panel or similiar in menu. Select that. From there you should have the choice to use the Integrated graphics or NVIDIA. The integrated graphics should be the Intel card. After you select one of these, hit apply in lower right of NVIDIA dialog box. Then run VDJ and see what you get. Don't forget to play with the Video FPS setting.
Posted Fri 10 Apr 15 @ 9:13 am
Tomas Cerny (VeeJay Lizard)
Hi Don.
Thank you for reply, but i do see only Intels card in VDJ setting. I have changed it in Nvidia settings. Dont know what is happening here :-(
Regards Tomas
Thank you for reply, but i do see only Intels card in VDJ setting. I have changed it in Nvidia settings. Dont know what is happening here :-(
Regards Tomas
Posted Mon 13 Apr 15 @ 7:27 am
Don Moir
Tomas, please restate your exact problem.
Posted Mon 13 Apr 15 @ 9:08 am
Tomas Cerny (VeeJay Lizard)
Hi Don,
take a look here please http://www.virtualdj.com/forums/199998/Hardware_Technical_Support/Intel_4000HD_and_Nvidia_640m_on_laptop_problem_.html
Regards Tomas.
take a look here please http://www.virtualdj.com/forums/199998/Hardware_Technical_Support/Intel_4000HD_and_Nvidia_640m_on_laptop_problem_.html
Regards Tomas.
Posted Mon 13 Apr 15 @ 12:05 pm