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Topic: Things I just don't understand.
First I love this software. Came across it in version 5 and has always been my go to for everything from scratching for production to live gigs.
But for the life of me I never knew how djs could make this mistake. I even had back a forth with users trying to defend and explain how I'm wrong and try to prove how this is correct.
Where in music ever in the history of music does a bar of music start at bar 0. There is no such bar in any form of music. With all the great thing this software can do, simple things like this is what keeps bad stigma about the software. This is music theory 101. A bar of music starts at 1:1 a count down ends at -1:4. Period. Simple things matter.

Posted Mon 07 Oct 19 @ 4:33 pm


Posted Mon 07 Oct 19 @ 11:38 pm
NicotuxHome userMember since 2014
Let's try again ;)

"music starts at 1:1 a count down ends at -1:4" oO Not exactly:
Yes, music starts at 1:1
- but count down ends AFTER -1:4 has ended
if you end at 4:4 you miss the last one time
last beat of bar is 4:4
end of bar is when this beat ends

-1:1...-1:2...-1:3...-1:4...1:1...+1:2...+1:3...+1:4...2:1
^........^........^........^........^.......^........^........^........^....
.............................|........|
countdoun ends here..^ music start here too
-1.0 -0.75 -0.50 -0.25 0.0 1.25 1.50 1.75 2.0
|----------- one bar ---------|--------- one bar ----------|

Music is simple math

start bar is 1:1 it is the position 0.0 or 0% in bar
ending beat 4:4 which position is 0.75 or 75% in bar
end OF bar is end of last beat 4:4 which is 4:4+1 time giving 1.0 or 100% in the bar

countdown ends after -1:4 which is -0,0625 + 0.0625 0.0 or 100% or 0% see forward

this is a representation issue, almost as for clock
1:30 is 1.50 hours or 150% of an hour
1 minute is 1/60 hours or 0.0166666 hours

end of hour is not 1:59
ending minute is 1:59 which is 0.98333 Hours
end of hour is 1:59+1 which is 1 hour

in a 4:4 time signature it's exactly the same
1 time is 1/16 bar one beat at every time start
:1 --> +0.0625
Music.....DJs
beat 1:1....0.00 bar
beat 1:2...0.0625 bar
beat 1.3...0.125 bar
beat 1.4...0.1875 bar
beat 2:1...0.25 bar
beat 2:1...0.3125 bar
beat 2.2...0.375 bar
beat 2:3...0.4375 bar
beat 3:1...0.50. bar
beat 3:2...0.5625 bar
beat 3.3...0.625 bar
beat 3.4...0.6875 bar
beat 4:1....0.75 bar
beat 4:2...0.8125 bar
beat 4.3...0.875 bar
beat 4:4...0.9375 bar
bar 2 beat 1:1...1.00.... bar

Posted Mon 07 Oct 19 @ 11:40 pm
[quote=Nicotux]Let's try again ;)

"music starts at 1:1 a count down ends at -1:4" oO Not exactly:
Yes, music starts at 1:1
- but count down ends AFTER -1:4 has ended
if you end at 4:4 you miss the last one time
last beat of bar is 4:4
end of bar is when this beat ends

-1:1...-1:2...-1:3...-1:4...1:1...+1:2...+1:3...+1:4...2:1
^........^........^........^........^.......^........^........^........^....
.............................|........|
countdoun ends here..^ music start here too
-1.0 -0.75 -0.50 -0.25 0.0 1.25 1.50 1.75 2.0
|----------- one bar ---------|--------- one bar ----------|

Music is simple math

start bar is 1:1 it is the position 0.0 or 0% in bar
ending beat 4:4 which position is 0.75 or 75% in bar
end OF bar is end of last beat 4:4 which is 4:4+1 time giving 1.0 or 100% in the bar

countdown ends after -1:4 which is -0,0625 + 0.0625 0.0 or 100% or 0% see forward

this is a representation issue, almost as for clock
1:30 is 1.50 hours or 150% of an hour
1 minute is 1/60 hours or 0.0166666 hours

end of hour is not 1:59
ending minute is 1:59 which is 0.98333 Hours
end of hour is 1:59+1 which is 1 hour

in a 4:4 time signature it's exactly the same
1 time is 1/16 bar one beat at every time start
:1 --> +0.0625
Music.....DJs
beat 1:1....0.00 bar
beat 1:2...0.0625 bar
beat 1.3...0.125 bar
beat 1.4...0.1875 bar
beat 2:1...0.25 bar
beat 2:1...0.3125 bar
beat 2.2...0.375 bar
beat 2:3...0.4375 bar
beat 3:1...0.50. bar
beat 3:2...0.5625 bar
beat 3.3...0.625 bar
beat 3.4...0.6875 bar
beat 4:1....0.75 bar
beat 4:2...0.8125 bar
beat 4.3...0.875 bar
beat 4:4...0.9375 bar
bar 2 beat 1:1...1.00.... bar

This the stuff I'm talking bout right here.....all this to break the rules of music. All that to have the phase off a whole bar. Please stop it. There is no 0.0 bar. Has anyone ever done production the first bar is 1:1 when you set a re-record it goes from -1:4 to 1:1. There is no 0.1. Y'all supposed to be djs. Sheesh...whats the disconnect...

Posted Tue 08 Oct 19 @ 3:50 am
You ever heard drop it on the zero...no you drop it on the 1.
In any music count have you ever heard "zero" no it's always 1...2...3...4 or you have never seen 0...1...2....3...4 because that ends in an odd amount of counts. Sheesh most music is 4/4 every thing we is a multiple of 4/4....4/16....quantize is in multiple of 4. Quarter note, eighth note, and so on. The beat counter in vdj is 4..or 16 or 32.... And there no 0. sheesh people it's basic music knowledge.
beat 1:1....0.00 bar is incorrect
Beat 1:1....1.00 bar is correct.
First beat of the first bar.

Posted Tue 08 Oct 19 @ 3:59 am
locodogPRO InfinityModeratorMember since 2013
It's no big deal, the bar count is just the beat count manipulated to be displayed how it is [bar:beat] if beat > 0, add 1 to calculated bar is pretty trivial script.

Posted Tue 08 Oct 19 @ 4:37 am
Yeah, I can see the issue here...

I was thinking that you guys were talking about any bars before the first beat grid marker (the "here's 1:1" marker?). That could arise because the first beat grid marker isn't necessarily going to be put at the very beginning of a track.

So I just loaded up a track that actually does start with a beat, right at the beginning. I put the red line (1:1 marker?) on the first beat. Loading it into a deck and looking the the rhythmwave, I can see the problem. The point where I put the marker (the very beginning of track) is not showing as 1:1 - the display is telling me that 1:1 is the next bar!

Posted Tue 08 Oct 19 @ 7:45 am
locodog wrote :
It's no big deal, the bar count is just the beat count manipulated to be displayed how it is [bar:beat] if beat > 0, add 1 to calculated bar is pretty trivial script.


Why do i have to add 1, why for the simplest thing there has to be a work around? Why can't it just be done correctly? I use the bar counter as a readout to song structure. Like a verse normally starts on the 9th bar but on my bar counter it read 8.1. Know the verse starts on the 9th bar i now know the next chorus will start 16 bars later starting on bar 25.

Posted Tue 08 Oct 19 @ 2:10 pm
NicotuxHome userMember since 2014
Groovindj is right there is a BIG BUG, not a simple issue
@Djratedxxx919 : Where you are seeing a bar counter - even there is no ':', I was seeing a timeline of beats - even it start at 0.1 - WE are both in error
What VDJ is displaying is none of both but tries to mix both with failures, sorry

- Phrase indicator is ok - beat 4; fills the beat; beat 1
ISSUE:
- there is a spurious "-1.1" just before a wrong "0.1" at time 0.0 aka beat 1:1 -- It maybe visualy erroneously see as 1:1 - but it is not : sign error and a bot
- next, at timeline 0.0, aka beat 1:1 display becomes "0.1" which make think its bar 0 whitch effectively would match nothing
but there is a dot making think "0.1" of the duration elapse - which is wrong either - it's really appearing too quickly at bar change to really notice

all track long you can see things like that : 42.1... 42.2... 42.3.... 42.4... and just quickly 42.1 & 43.1 ... which is in reality bar 44 and thus 43 already played, playing 1st beat
A SPURIOUS back in time "42.1" is inserted as for the SPURIOUS -1.1 which comes after -1.4 and before 0.1 at start of tracks

IMO in an attempt to display something matching both representations at once VDJ is displaying something confusing for both


Posted Tue 08 Oct 19 @ 11:19 pm
If its called a bar counter it should behave as a bar counter. All those other things matter not. When i click that check next to bar counter I expect to see a bar counter.

Posted Wed 09 Oct 19 @ 2:58 am
You guys are funny.

Posted Wed 09 Oct 19 @ 8:43 pm
Thank You for addressing and fixing this problem. Now my ears and eyes will sync properly.

Posted 7 days ago @ 1:30 pm